2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

Joshwaa · 2024-10-05 22:45:31

sad 1st post on here so bare with me, probably quiet lengthy but just to give you a bit of history.

2005 Citroen dispatch 2.0HDI

2020 in-between lockdowns bought the van for £400 expecting it to last the remaining MOT (8 months)....here we are 4 years later, a few new parts, couple of services and 2 new outsills

Anyway the problem....I'm not electrically minded but mechanically okay? any help greatly appreciated, mechanic it's getting booked into see is a 2 week lead time so if I can have a bash at some "stuff" between now and then and get it going happy days

So, started van as usual, started as usual off I drove 1 mile to work as usual all good. 9 hours later after work got in van....won't start. Cranks very well, battery got juice.

CANNOT hear the fuel pump priming and still can't now

Fair enough, £70 for a new pump now installed....same outcome won't prime

Read about the relay....£20 for a new one now installed still the same

Read about the cutoff switch....pressed it but not sure how it feels when triggered, anyway still the same

X3 cheap code readers won't connect to the van although they have in the past.

Fuses checked

Now my parts cannon is empty and so is my head.

Any help, tags or tips at all appreciated

Josh

Last edited by Joshwaa (2024-10-22 21:08:40)

Casper · 2024-10-05 22:53:35

Has that got the oval fuel filter housing like the 1.9D?? The aftermarket seals on top are renowned for being shit and letting in air. Also your return pipes, are any wet? The internal rubber can crack where it connects to the injectors and also let in air. To much air will prevent it from starting.

Joshwaa · 2024-10-05 22:59:05

Yeah cylinder type fuel filter housing, I'll have a check tomorrow but there's zero diesel leaks anywhere. I've had the diesel filter off and the lines to it. Just confusing me as to why I can't hear the prime since it's stopped working

Casper · 2024-10-05 23:16:49

Your return also goes to a thin plastic pipe on the filter housing lid. That also cracks, brakes easy however just as air is getting in that does not mean fuel has to dribble out. I may be talking keek and its another issue but worth a check. You got a prime bulb you can pump??? If so try pumping that before you turn the key to build up pressure. I moved on to another brand/van but it is also can suffer with air intake. If i read the OBD reader the codes come back with low fuel pressure. Folk on our facebook page have been recommended to get a new pump by garages when all along its just been air getting in.

Tiree · 2024-10-05 23:29:45

If you don't hear the lift pump when you turn the ignition to ON ...

The lift pump in the fuel tank hangs from the top of the tank.

The connecting cables come out the top of the tank and into a waterproof connector - you should be able to locate this coming out the top of the fuel tank without removing anything.

Both the male and female terminals on this connector can get corroded.

Try disconnecting the two ends and use sandpaper or similar to clean the pins and something like a tiny screwdriver to scrape away any corrosion in the sockets.

Good luck!

Casper · 2024-10-05 23:37:38

Tiree wrote:

If you don't hear the lift pump when you turn the ignition to ON ...
The lift pump in the fuel tank hangs from the top of the tank.
The connecting cables come out the top of the tank and into a waterproof connector - you should be able to locate this coming out the top of the fuel tank without removing anything.
Both the male and female terminals on this connector can get corroded.
Try disconnecting the two ends and use sandpaper or similar to clean the pins and something like a tiny screwdriver to scrape away any corrosion in the sockets.
Good luck!

Who's the new guy big_smile

RegW · 2024-10-05 23:46:58

The weather getting into connectors must always be a consideration on old bangers like ours
As well as Tirees suggestion I'd add opening checking cleaning the 3 ECU connectors too
A guy recently had a no start fault which eventually led him to this.
I'm going to check/clean mine soon and squish some switch cleaner in there.

RegW · 2024-10-05 23:49:10

Casper wrote:

Who's the new guy

Dunno mate, they'll let anybody in here nowadays
I've noticed the place has really gone downhill since I joined.....

Tiree · 2024-10-05 23:49:20

Casper wrote:

Who's the new guy

asleep

Casper · 2024-10-05 23:50:47

I bought my first tin on contact cleaner for a few electrical issues the other month. Why have i never bought this stuff before???? Got WD40's brand and its blood amazing stuff. Does what it says on the tin and also good for cleaning the thick oil oil and grease off the skin.

Tiree · 2024-10-05 23:51:24

RegW wrote:

Casper wrote:

Who's the new guy
Dunno mate, they'll let anybody in here nowadays
I've noticed the place has really gone downhill since I joined.....

lol

Casper · 2024-10-05 23:51:59

RegW wrote:

Casper wrote:

Who's the new guy
Dunno mate, they'll let anybody in here nowadays
I've noticed the place has really gone downhill since I joined.....

Special Brew is never a good look big_smile

Tiree · 2024-10-05 23:53:12

Contact cleaner in the connector also a great shout!

RegW · 2024-10-05 23:58:57

Anyone with an old bike especially will have seen plenty of oxidised electrical connectors
Some I know folk insist on using dielectric grease to keep the weather out
but Vaseline or grease is just as good
you just need something non conductive or reactive to act as a water/oxygen barrier

Last edited by RegW (2024-10-05 23:59:19)

RegW · 2024-10-06 00:03:00

Casper wrote:

RegW wrote:
Casper wrote:

Who's the new guy
Dunno mate, they'll let anybody in here nowadays
I've noticed the place has really gone downhill since I joined.....
Special Brew is never a good look

Cant afford the Buckie

kenbw2 · 2024-10-06 00:31:14

I don't know how obvious the noise from the lift pump is but can you confirm for reals that it's not working by disconnecting a fuel line on the low pressure side and see if diesel comes out? That'll confirm for definite

Casper · 2024-10-06 00:32:44

RegW wrote:

Anyone with an old bike especially will have seen plenty of oxidised electrical connectors
Some I know folk insist on using dielectric grease to keep the weather out
but Vaseline or grease is just as good
you just need something non conductive or reactive to act as a water/oxygen barrier

Funny you should mention Vaseline as i was just talking to the wife about that tonight. I work outdoors and suffer cracked lips a lot. Its the only thing that works but the small pocket tins are not the same stuff that is in the jar/tub. Wife says why dont you just take a tub to work. Nooooooo wayyyyyyy, i said. Why???? What if i got ran over and died. Folk will forever think WTF did he carry Vaseline around with him for?? Anyway its great stuff for the connectors that work. Been packing it into bike connectors for years, Also car/van door rubbers. Run some round the matting edge to prevent winter door freezing shut as well as sticking some in the locks.

Casper · 2024-10-06 00:34:29

RegW wrote:

Casper wrote:
RegW wrote:
Dunno mate, they'll let anybody in here nowadays
I've noticed the place has really gone downhill since I joined.....
Special Brew is never a good look
Cant afford the Buckie

Only ever had a sip and that was enough. Vile stuff that only a Glaswegian could appreciate tongue

Joshwaa · 2024-10-06 13:39:30

Thanks for replies!

I'm gonna get under it again and start from tank back to engine bay. I've got a can of electrical cleaner.

I've taken the feed hose that goes to fuel filter off and there's nothing there at all

I've a feeling something isn't communicating especially with code readers not been able to connect to the OBD port

RegW · 2024-10-06 15:14:05

had a look at some diagrams and see the fuel pump is powered from Fuse F7 in BF01
my notes say BF01 is the "fuse box under bonnet"
so that's worth checking

Joshwaa · 2024-10-06 15:20:09

RegW wrote:

had a look at some diagrams and see the fuel pump is powered from Fuse F7 in BF01
my notes say BF01 is the "fuse box under bonnet"
so that's worth checking

All fuses checked ✔️ they were all good. Will check again for what it's worth mind.

RegW · 2024-10-06 15:46:17

Where is the relay situated, can you get a meter in there to see if there is any power going out to the pump?

If my info is correct, power to the pump goes out of the relay on
pin 4, cable 121 ( blue) and goes into the pump on pin 3 cable 1235 ( blue)
presumably it changes number at a connector midway.

Last edited by RegW (2024-10-06 15:55:53)

Joshwaa · 2024-10-06 15:52:29

RegW wrote:

Where is the relay situated, can you get a meter in there to see if there is any power going out to the pump?

Relay is located on the right hand side bolted to the wing next to the battery. There a funny looking thing to be honest and this has been changed for a new one.

It's got 12v going to this but I've read this communicates back to the ecu and the ecu says yes fuel pump start. Whether I've read this correctly is another matter

RegW · 2024-10-06 16:05:14

My view of the diagram I have suggests it's powered via the fuse and inertia (impact) relay at switch on and
the solenoids actuated by the ECU pulling the line to ground on the relay coil

The inertia switch looks like simple on/off device which is normally closed unless an impact opens it thereby
cutting off power so there should be continuity between pins 3 and 1 normally
Its on the lowside of the pump relay and if open will interrupt the connection to the ECU and prevent it
operating the relay/pump

JohnDragonMan · 2024-10-07 22:24:30

i think we need to start diagnosing why you cant connect to the ecu via the OBD port. it sounds to me like the ecu is not powering up.

so. my knowledge on these vans is not all that good (yes really).

do you get all lights on the dash come on when you turn the ignition on? including the yellow transistor... err the thing that looks like a "K" otherwise known as the check engine light?

if that lights up it usually means that the ECU is in good order while on ignition only. (seriously try it on other stuff, if you uplug the ecu the check engine light goes out.. its a good way to find out if the ecu has a power issue)
the ECU will still power up even if it has an immobiliser fault.. say the RFID chip in the key stops working. you will still get the yellow "K" looking light

one thing to try is a jumper cable clamped to the metal body of the ECU then to the negative battery terminal. this would eliminate any earthing faults.

i also would actually unplug the main ecu connectors (with the battery disconnected) to see what the condition of the connectors are like.

i would also check your ignition switch.. you can test the switch easy. drop the steering wheel down using the adjuster, take off the cowling top cover and you will see the main igntion switch plug.
unplug all connectors with large wires they will be colours like white, blue and i think yellow.. maybe others. they will be the only large wires.
now make sure you van is in neutral or if you are unsure keep the clutch pressed down because the next step could engage the starter motor.
get a thick ish bit of wire and bridge across the different wires on i think the left side plugs (youll get some little sparks but the power in a car battery is very safe to touch so worry not about electric shocks it wont happen). one will be battery power, one will be ignition switch position 1 (acc), one will be ignition switch position 2 which is glow plug mode/engine run (the one that powers up the ecu), and one will be the starter.
you are effectively bypassing the ignition switch. if you power glow plug mode and the ecu "K" light comes on this is good it means the ecu lives again and the solution is to replace the ignition switch
i repaired a Vauxhall Zafera with this same fault once.. been to 3 separate garages and they diagnosed it with a dead ecu. these "plug in" mechanics only know what an ECU will tell them. you need an old school mechanic.
shame you are not local to me i would have come and had a look.. i really like electrical work on vehicles.

now as far as i know, the ECU does have a relay.. i am pretty sure its commonly referred to as the "glow plug" relay. i have never known one to fail but i guess its a possibility. its located kinda behind the drivers side headlight (if its right hand drive)

i mean you could also test for voltage on a sensor while the ignition is on too. that way we would know if the ECU is functioning. give the mas air flow sensor a unplug and test for voltage on the different pins. one of them (i think there's 4 or 5 on these) will have some kind of voltage on it while the ignition is in glow plug mode. #
to test for voltage use a simple bulb test. get a small wattage bulb like say a side light bulb, earth one side with some wire and the other side will be the testing probe. try not to short anything out with it though.. the ecu does auto kill power to the sensors if it detects a dead short thanfully, it wont burn its self out.
now i think the sensors only work on about 5v so the bulb will only glow a bit.. i could be wrong though i have tested many ecus over the years.. it all merges into one.

on some vehicles, pin 1 on the OBD port can be an ignition live but its not standardised. i am not sure if our vans are like this.

i hope some of this helps in some way.

fun fact: the "K" on the ECU light on our vans is the electrical symbol for a component called a Transistor.

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#1 2024-10-05 22:45:31

2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#2 2024-10-05 22:53:35

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#3 2024-10-05 22:59:05

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#4 2024-10-05 23:16:49

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#5 2024-10-05 23:29:45

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#6 2024-10-05 23:37:38

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#7 2024-10-05 23:46:58

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#8 2024-10-05 23:49:10

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#9 2024-10-05 23:49:20

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#10 2024-10-05 23:50:47

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#11 2024-10-05 23:51:24

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#12 2024-10-05 23:51:59

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#13 2024-10-05 23:53:12

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#14 2024-10-05 23:58:57

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#15 2024-10-06 00:03:00

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#16 2024-10-06 00:31:14

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#17 2024-10-06 00:32:44

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#18 2024-10-06 00:34:29

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#19 2024-10-06 13:39:30

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#20 2024-10-06 15:14:05

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#21 2024-10-06 15:20:09

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#22 2024-10-06 15:46:17

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#23 2024-10-06 15:52:29

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#24 2024-10-06 16:05:14

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

#25 2024-10-07 22:24:30

Re: 2005 citroen dispatch 2.0hdi cranking - won't start - SOLVED

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