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#1 2019-02-17 14:16:42

Ricko
Member
From: SW Lancs
Registered: 2017-01-18
Posts: 160

2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

Hi, my ultra reliable 2.0Hdi is not starting, I was using it up until about 10 days ago, and swapped to another vehicle. Just came to it today, it'll crank over and fire on Easy Start but nothing else. Suspect it's a fuel issue or could be an immobiliser issue.
I wanted to head off this week to do the SWC300.
Any thoughts or ideas????
Cheers


2004 Citroen Dispatch 2.0 Hdi

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#2 2019-02-17 16:07:39

OAT
Member
From: Borders/Dales
Registered: 2017-01-03
Posts: 234

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

Strange one.  I can't see how easy start would overcome anything but low starting temperature problems or perhaps a delay in proper fuel delivery at startup.  An air leak or a failing pump perhaps? 

You must be getting proper fuel delivery once at tick over as it runs on ok.

Could the fuel pump not be performing properly till up to speed?  The easy start getting it turning over fast enough to deliver and run on?

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#3 2019-02-17 16:34:05

Ricko
Member
From: SW Lancs
Registered: 2017-01-18
Posts: 160

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

I've tried to test the power to the stop solenoid.
I put a meter on the terminal plug and got my son to switch the ignition on.
Nothing.
I also put the meter between each terminal and negative.
Still nothing.
I'm wondering if it's an electrical problem.


2004 Citroen Dispatch 2.0 Hdi

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#4 2019-02-18 00:45:38

OAT
Member
From: Borders/Dales
Registered: 2017-01-03
Posts: 234

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

Unless it's the glow plugs not working, how might easy start overcome an electrical problem?

.

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#5 2019-02-18 00:55:17

kenbw2
Member
From: Bradford/Preston/Anywhere
Registered: 2017-11-26
Posts: 249

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

OAT wrote:

how might easy start overcome an electrical problem?

.


It's the HDi so everything's electronic. If it's not telling the pump to send fuel into the engine, easy start is gonna bypass that. That said, if it's solenoid I think the 1.9s will have that too.

Ricko - Can you crack the injectors on that one to see if it's pumping fuel?

Last edited by kenbw2 (2019-02-18 00:55:42)


2000 Citroen Dispatch 1.9TD XUD9 Upcoming Camper
1999 Citroen Dispatch 1.9D DW8 Camper Conversion + full time home
1996 Peugeot 806 1.9TD XUD9 Spare vehicle
1998 Citroen Synergie 1.9TD XUD9 Snapped timing belt

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#6 2019-02-18 04:23:15

Ricko
Member
From: SW Lancs
Registered: 2017-01-18
Posts: 160

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

I suppose the Easy Start thing is a legacy of owning old Land Rovers!!
I've never really got my head around 'modern' diesels!!
I'll check the fuse diagram in case there's one that covers the pump electrics etc, I'll also check the fuel cut-off switch.
I suspect it's an electrical thing.
Fuming as I want to hit the road asap!!


2004 Citroen Dispatch 2.0 Hdi

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#7 2019-02-18 16:59:53

Ricko
Member
From: SW Lancs
Registered: 2017-01-18
Posts: 160

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

Ended up towing it to a diesel garage on the nearby ind est. Poor connection/corrosion on a terminal on the main fuse board. Preventing power to the main relay. I'd have never found it.


2004 Citroen Dispatch 2.0 Hdi

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#8 2019-02-19 00:08:52

vaz2121
Member
From: SW. Scotland
Registered: 2015-08-31
Posts: 481

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

We had an HDI 110 rapier 307 about 8 or 9 yrs ago and it would turn over but not start ..... New starter & battery still no go .... New common rail fuel pressure switch thing .... No start.......  Squirt of Easy start, burst into life......

This tac-tik only worked for about a month all be it was a PITA.............. but it made it go........

The final straw came when it point blank refused to fire and a local diesel mechanic who was more up to speed on these New Fangled machines .... got A thing with 6 little bottles (plastic) along with pipes which he hung on bonnet hook and as we only needed 4 connected them to the diesel return on the injectors............ I was then told turn over engine an have someone watch the fuel return to bottles .... however just by turning my ignition on there was enough pressure in fuel pump to rapidly start filling a return bottle which indicated a faulty Leaking injector...........

I'm lead to believe that HDI's and the likes have about 40...... 50 psi fuel pressure from tank and the diesel pump increases that to some insane pressure in the (common) Rail {Hence pressure switch} But if an injector does not maintain a certain pressure within rail the ECU will not allow engine to fire (hence also new battery,starter, rail pressure switch) the easy start by-passed all this and with the engine kicking under its own steam it managed to meet min line pressure so continued to run..... until that pressure was lost entirely through faulty injector.............
I am also lead to believe I was extremly lucky that Not only did I find an operating injector down the breakers out of a 405 Hdi with matching ref numbers it also had matching suffix codes as well and when fitted the car ran like a sweetie without any re coding needed......... I then had a variable vane fault re-occur(sticky and rusty vanes) on the turbo a few times and I finished up selling it when it was in bits down the garage .................... Safe to say I was some what pi***d off with it........ I ended up buying the older 306  DW8 (F*****g french cars lol ) and never really looked back with it in 100,000mls +

Theres a youngish lad with a breathed upon 306 HDI ......GTI6 lookalike nearby and he's been having odd issues with his .....and as would have it......... Electrical wireing corrosion conection problems there too.............

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#9 2019-02-19 01:41:32

kenbw2
Member
From: Bradford/Preston/Anywhere
Registered: 2017-11-26
Posts: 249

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

vaz2121 wrote:

We had an HDI 110 rapier 307 about 8 or 9 yrs ago and it would turn over but not start ..... New starter & battery still no go .... New common rail fuel pressure switch thing .... No start.......  Squirt of Easy start, burst into life......

This tac-tik only worked for about a month all be it was a PITA.............. but it made it go........

The final straw came when it point blank refused to fire and a local diesel mechanic who was more up to speed on these New Fangled machines .... got A thing with 6 little bottles (plastic) along with pipes which he hung on bonnet hook and as we only needed 4 connected them to the diesel return on the injectors............ I was then told turn over engine an have someone watch the fuel return to bottles .... however just by turning my ignition on there was enough pressure in fuel pump to rapidly start filling a return bottle which indicated a faulty Leaking injector...........

I'm lead to believe that HDI's and the likes have about 40...... 50 psi fuel pressure from tank and the diesel pump increases that to some insane pressure in the (common) Rail {Hence pressure switch} But if an injector does not maintain a certain pressure within rail the ECU will not allow engine to fire (hence also new battery,starter, rail pressure switch) the easy start by-passed all this and with the engine kicking under its own steam it managed to meet min line pressure so continued to run..... until that pressure was lost entirely through faulty injector.............
I am also lead to believe I was extremly lucky that Not only did I find an operating injector down the breakers out of a 405 Hdi with matching ref numbers it also had matching suffix codes as well and when fitted the car ran like a sweetie without any re coding needed......... I then had a variable vane fault re-occur(sticky and rusty vanes) on the turbo a few times and I finished up selling it when it was in bits down the garage .................... Safe to say I was some what pi***d off with it........ I ended up buying the older 306  DW8 (F*****g french cars lol ) and never really looked back with it in 100,000mls +

Theres a youngish lad with a breathed upon 306 HDI ......GTI6 lookalike nearby and he's been having odd issues with his .....and as would have it......... Electrical wireing corrosion conection problems there too.............

Oh look, a big list of problems my crappy 68bph DW8 will never have!


2000 Citroen Dispatch 1.9TD XUD9 Upcoming Camper
1999 Citroen Dispatch 1.9D DW8 Camper Conversion + full time home
1996 Peugeot 806 1.9TD XUD9 Spare vehicle
1998 Citroen Synergie 1.9TD XUD9 Snapped timing belt

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#10 2019-02-19 02:35:45

OAT
Member
From: Borders/Dales
Registered: 2017-01-03
Posts: 234

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

kenbw2 wrote:

Oh look, a big list of problems my crappy 68bph DW8 will never have!

Me too.  I was seriously considering something newer later this year but the cpu's and excess electronics seem to be unavoidable.

Thanks for the explanation vaz.

Glad you got it sorted Ricko.  When you setting off?  Look out for ken and I as you pass through the borders.  Suppose you will be going up M6 for the west coast though.

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#11 2019-02-19 09:35:31

Ricko
Member
From: SW Lancs
Registered: 2017-01-18
Posts: 160

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

UPDATE: Picked it up this morning, they couldn't start it when they moved it out of the garage, they had to wiggle some wires etc to get the ecu light to come on. Fair play they've not charged me but they're really geared up for mechanical issues on diesels. The fault is in the region of the main fuse board under the engine. They've given me the name of an auto elec specialist in the village and told me to take it there.
So desperate to get away!!!!


2004 Citroen Dispatch 2.0 Hdi

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#12 2019-02-19 14:47:41

vaz2121
Member
From: SW. Scotland
Registered: 2015-08-31
Posts: 481

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

kenbw2 wrote:

Oh look, a big list of problems my crappy 68bph DW8 will never have!

I'm very much inclined to agree with you...... my 306 DW8 has the bosch pump fitted and the van DW8/B the less desirable Lucus Cav - Delphi........... However wonderfull technology advancement is and I'm not really bothered if I am something of a Luddite on this I'll take the tortoise and pass the Hare on the hard sholder

Modern cars...diesels are so restricted with all this emissions stuff these Days ....... No wonder we can't rely on them Never mind age related troubles which comes to us all...........
(And Diesels are much much more fragile than ever)

What power could they produce if they were allowed to BREATH properly

My Bench mark diesel was a 1986 2 series Scania V8 that I ran all over the Uk/Europe on 38 ton Fridge work mostly ........... 420 hp on full song averaged 7MPG
By 2000/2001 I had progressed to a 4 series Scania V8 with an increase  from 14ltr to 16ltr with another 110 hp up to 530 but controled by EDC... (electronic diesel control) wich gave it Euro 2 status...... Don't get me wrong this was a decent going and relatively hard working machine (I'd have it over today's Adblue Boll**)  but it lacked the raw power/grunt of 2 generations prior when climing The pyrenees or Mont Blanc...Aosta Valley and the likes...... (I did have a 3 sreies centurion Scania 450 hp but it had EDC as well) but did get 10 MPG on average and I was able to gross 44tons on 6 axles

(I don't know if I blame VW... I suspect they were unlucky and they got caught .... {The other manufactures seemed to keep quiet and their heads down]....... But then how does the person at large expect to Have a spotless clean Diesel, have more power and use less fuel ?)

{On the variable vane Turbo ......I'm told if it's rusty sticky gummed up .... take of pipe an fill with oven cleaner and leave for couple hours As per  .... then flush out and Bob should be your Auntie}

Ricko:... Would a squirt of electical contact cleaner do the temporary fix?

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#13 2019-02-19 15:12:51

tee_cee
Member
Registered: 2016-03-18
Posts: 187

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

Ricko wrote:

UPDATE: Picked it up this morning, they couldn't start it when they moved it out of the garage, they had to wiggle some wires etc to get the ecu light to come on. Fair play they've not charged me but they're really geared up for mechanical issues on diesels. The fault is in the region of the main fuse board under the engine. They've given me the name of an auto elec specialist in the village and told me to take it there.
So desperate to get away!!!!

Check the fuses for heat damage. I've had a few fuses starting to corrode & cause a poor connection. As vaz said a squirt of Servisol 10 can root out the problem

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#14 2019-02-19 19:13:44

Ricko
Member
From: SW Lancs
Registered: 2017-01-18
Posts: 160

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

Having spent nearly 40 mins looking for my 25yr old can of Servisol to no effect, I've just dashed out to get some contact cleaner.
I started her up and had a wiggle of the fuses/relays under the bonnet hoping she'd cut out to give me a clue - nothing.
Raining now, so I'll have a squirt in the morning.
Don't fancy it cutting out in deepest, darkest D&G!!


2004 Citroen Dispatch 2.0 Hdi

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#15 2019-02-22 21:32:31

Ricko
Member
From: SW Lancs
Registered: 2017-01-18
Posts: 160

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

UPDATE: Wiring fault, Failure of multifunction relay, ECU plug fault
sad


2004 Citroen Dispatch 2.0 Hdi

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#16 2019-02-22 22:04:07

vaz2121
Member
From: SW. Scotland
Registered: 2015-08-31
Posts: 481

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

Ricko wrote:

UPDATE: Wiring fault, Failure of multifunction relay, ECU plug fault
sad

Does that mean New Expensive Parts ?........... If so I think you've been lucky in your bad luck as it could have done this and stranded you in the middle of the Raiders Road

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#17 2019-02-22 22:12:28

Ricko
Member
From: SW Lancs
Registered: 2017-01-18
Posts: 160

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

If I'd have got stranded on the forest road (Are they open yet?), I'd have hidden it in the bushes, lived in it and gone feral!!
Yes, very grateful that I wasn't on the road when this happened!!
I'm keeping my fingers crossed!!!


2004 Citroen Dispatch 2.0 Hdi

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#18 2019-03-01 19:19:26

Ricko
Member
From: SW Lancs
Registered: 2017-01-18
Posts: 160

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

New multifunction relay, trace and fault find wiring, replace damaged wiring. £160 (2 hrs labour, parts, vat)
Up and running again!!!


2004 Citroen Dispatch 2.0 Hdi

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#19 2019-03-01 22:48:26

vaz2121
Member
From: SW. Scotland
Registered: 2015-08-31
Posts: 481

Re: 2.0 Hdi not starting!!!

big_smile  I'm getting the cobwebs blown off my van stuff this weekend (Aired and out washing machine) to if nothing else get back into the swing of even a night or two doon the   W ater as they say and a Fish Supper and home...............



Ricko wrote:

New multifunction relay, trace and fault find wiring, replace damaged wiring. £160 (2 hrs labour, parts, vat)
Up and running again!!!

big_smile  big_smile  You'll be glad of the freedom now that you've been released if you've not already set sail   ......... But I'm afraid your correct the Raiders rd is closed to vehicles till April

Although I hear a whisper that some uninitiated "campers" have been doing just that .......... although I'm not for trying until April ........... (Handy having van during Rally season.......... Prior it was my Lada 4x4 .....Saved the hike and took us deep into stages)

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