DVLA says my van doesn't look like a camper from the outside

kenbw2 · 2019-08-30 17:00:56

Submitted my document - in fact I itrally took the letter I sent for my white van, and replaced the pictures. SO everything exactly the same

But then this came back

I gather they've been getting arsey like this lately.

Anyone got any experience in what I need to do to change the outside?

Just some stickers, maybe I can even just get away with an LPG sticker on the back? I want as minimal as possible really because I quite like how it looks as it is.

Zippypilot · 2019-08-30 17:22:09

Hi Ken, I have a neighbour that converted a long wheelbase transit low roof minibus into a full camper inside, externally he did nothing. I will ask him about this with DVLA (notorious arsey organisation!) I will get back to you. I am suprised you need to change the exterior to qualify it as a motor caravan!

kenbw2 · 2019-08-30 17:28:52

The annoying thing is my white Dispatch went through with no external mods. It's well documented that they've been arsey this year unfortunately. Unless it's bcause I haven't put the solar panel on the blue van's roof roof yet? Surely not.

When did your neighbour do his?

Last edited by kenbw2 (2019-08-30 17:29:25)

Zippypilot · 2019-08-30 17:36:31

Hi, he converted it three months ago, the only external thing is a wood burner chimney! Not sure if he has imformed DVLA but he is fastidious so think he would have done

OAT · 2019-08-30 19:12:17

I couldn't believe it when I heard about this earlier this year.

Absolutely ridiculous!

The definition "motor home" is a description of it's new use, nothing to do with looks. They really should define what they are after if yjru are going to make such vague demands.

I would enjoy getting technical with them on this. EG.. would stickers reading "THIS IS A MOTORHOME" in 6" letters satisfy them or do they really want surfer dudes and palm tree stickers.

I think an FOI request is needed. DVLA are changing their interpretation of the law to suit themselves. It was the same with their previous demands for 2 ring burners.

Just checked... someone has already put an foi request in:-

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/ … n_under_v5

Awaiting response, reply due no later than 11 September.

edit...just reread the foi... I didn't think the term "campervan" was actualy a category according to DVLA so this request maybe won't get the info required.

Last edited by OAT (2019-08-30 19:18:27)

Casper · 2019-08-30 20:31:39

Do you have an awning? Show the van with that up as the only criteria they ask is a t least one window into the living area and one door. Point this out to them as as yet they are to issue anything new to be added. I got my Convoy changed to camper a couple of years back with no issue but wish a never bothered. It was a bus before at £165 tax. Now its £235 or more. Saying that if they keep knocking folk back does this mean i can add a few 100 quid into my resale value as its a motor caravan.

vaz2121 · 2019-08-30 21:19:50

It is well documented for the better part of this year that they've been getting arsey..........

As O A T rightly pointed out "it's a description of it's use" ........ "No longer a Comecial Vehile involved in carrying goods" ............

And Casper on their Descriptors............

I'm sure I also read somewhere It's Self builds that are Suffering ...........

Does this mean Comercial Converters have Lobbied the DVLA ...... Or Greased the palm of a Politician or three

P.S. I do't think stickers would be enough to pull it off...........

OAT · 2019-08-30 21:54:39

vaz2121 wrote:

P.S. I do't think stickers would be enough to pull it off...........

How about a Winnebago vinyl wrap? smile

I wasn't being totally facetious with my suggestion of labeling it as a motorhome though. The wording of their refusal says :-

" Unless the vehicle is altered to be identifiable as a motor caravan, the agencies decision is final.

How better could it be identifiable?

Although in the wider scale of the current collapse of the establishment, this is only a minor mater, the DVLA's recent reinterpretation of long established understanding of the law is odd and as vaz suggests, they are being driven by something. The threat of finality in their response is well out of order too.

They are getting stroppy for your non compliance to their as yet un-defined requirements. They are not the law and have no right to change it. They are only administrators who should work under it.

My guess is that it's probably a response to the trend for so called stealth camping and at the request of the police. Whatever it is though, this isn't the way to do it. I am sure we will hear more.

kenbw2 · 2019-08-30 23:22:14

Yea I agree it's probably a response to stealth. I literally live in it, but yea of course we must categorise it as a work van. ffs.

I don't want bloody vinyl wrap, but I think I'll have to. Or I put the solar panel on and see if that satiates them?

Last edited by kenbw2 (2019-08-30 23:22:40)

vaz2121 · 2019-08-30 23:39:28

OAT wrote:

I wasn't being totally facetious with my suggestion of labeling it as a motorhome though.

You raise a valid point .............

"This is a Motorhome" sticker would identify externally the purpose of the vehicle especially helping plod know what their dealing with and would this answer the question WHY I have seen of late ..... What appear to be "professionally" converted vans as opossed to a chassis with a caravan screwed on the back.............

With the Wording "Euro Camper" emblazoned across it .............

Is it just me ------ "The debacles of the establishment" of late highlights a level of corruption

"No lets not go there"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqF_nPbX_Ow

Last edited by vaz2121 (2019-08-30 23:46:24)

Casper · 2019-08-31 00:00:59

If motor caravan means that much to you/anyone financially or whatever then jump whatever hoops they want. After that you can do almost what you want with the van. I put in quick removable units as i also needed the van for work (Big NoNo) Faked a fixed table and i have since did two refits.

tee_cee · 2019-08-31 10:15:05

Sorry to say that it looks like you are not alone
https://www.change.org/p/uk-parliament- … motorhomes

k_wyndham_t · 2019-09-01 10:25:02

What were the pictures supplied so the only external mod needed is at least one side windows but you have to supply pictures of outside showing numberplate but showing its a camper conversion.
In my case I took several pictures of outside Inc with numberplate shown and with side and rear doors open to show it is the same van as the interior photos showed, one for instance had the back door with number plate on closed but other open and you could see my cupboards and rock and roll inside.

kenbw2 · 2019-09-01 13:01:35

Hmm yea maybe I should try that. Hopefully I don't need to put stickers on it or whatever. Maybe an LPG sticker?

OAT · 2019-09-01 14:46:20

kenbw2 wrote:

Maybe an LPG sticker?

Don't think that would do Ken. Many workvans have lpg too.

As Casper suggests, is it important for you to reclassify? Is there still any worthwhile insurance saving these days? You might be able to get around their unreasonable and unspecified demands but is it worth it if you have to mess with your van? Must admit that a legitimate 70mph on the motorway is handy.

Longer term though I think this is a sign that someone doesn't like the recent rise in the use of van conversions as campers. If so, it won't stop here.

tee_cee · 2019-09-01 16:33:59

OAT wrote:

kenbw2 wrote:
Maybe an LPG sticker?
Don't think that would do Ken. Many workvans have lpg too.
As Casper suggests, is it important for you to reclassify? Is there still any worthwhile insurance saving these days? You might be able to get around their unreasonable and unspecified demands but is it worth it if you have to mess with your van? Must admit that a legitimate 70mph on the motorway is handy.
Longer term though I think this is a sign that someone doesn't like the recent rise in the use of van conversions as campers. If so, it won't stop here.

I could have sworn it was 60mph on the motorway as well - but it is actually the same as a car.

kenbw2 · 2019-09-01 17:37:15

Yea it makes like £300 difference on insurance between the two vans, but yea it's mostly the 60/70mph on single/dual carriageways. I have a turbo now, I want to use it!

tee_cee · 2019-09-02 08:58:46

kenbw2 wrote:

Yea it makes like £300 difference on insurance between the two vans, but yea it's mostly the 60/70mph on single/dual carriageways. I have a turbo now, I want to use it!

Shouldn't be that much of a difference. Try Aviva van insurance, and select non-commercial use. For me it came out slightly cheaper than camper insurance, though it only covered me for the UK.

kenbw2 · 2019-09-02 11:29:58

There's a bit more to it with the fact that I was swapping between the two policies and length of policy. I'll take a look at Aviva, see what they say.

Would still be nice to convert though. I notice k_wyndham_t's van is externally the same as mine, just with the swoosh.

Casper · 2019-09-02 23:31:02

What age are you? I am 55 in a good postal area and clean driving licence. My big old convoy is only just over £200 and my dispatch is 500 as business insurance though this crowd.

https://www.aib-insurance.co.uk/

kenbw2 · 2019-09-03 22:59:20

I'm gonna give this a go sending this to the DVLA, and give them a copy of the document I sent for both vans.

I’m writing following your statement that my vehicle [Blue Van] cannot be identified externally as a Motor Caravan. I’m not clear why this is.
This is actually the second Citroen Dispatch I’ve converted – the previous one being the same model with registration [White Van]. When converting the first, white camper, I made sure to follow the DVLA’s guidance at https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati … -motorhome.
The changes made to [White Van] were accepted and the DVLA reclassified the vehicle as a Motor Caravan.
I have made identical modifications to [Blue Van], and created an identical document as evidence, yet the DVLA have rejected this reclassification.
I have attached the two documents I’ve sent to the DVLA which should make clear that the two vehicles have been modified identically.
Please could you review these, and ensure that the decision you make with the blue vehicle [Blue Van] is consistent with the decision that was made for the white vehicle [White Van].
If you do decide that the blue vehicle [Blue Van] cannot be reclassified because it differs from the white one externally, please clarify what differences I should be aware of, and what modifications I need to make in order to satisfy the reclassification.

Last edited by kenbw2 (2019-09-03 23:00:20)

OAT · 2019-09-04 00:42:19

Exclent letter ken. I look forward to their response.

Looks like they are digging their heels in though :-

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/ … ng-1411900

And :-

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/ … ng-1387061

With others similar awaiting response.

They mention papers relating to consultations with police. They might be worth a look if published?

P's. ..nicked your spot again. smile

Casper · 2019-09-04 22:11:34

DVLA are unable to change the body type to motorhome, they are still able to use the vehicle for this purpose. That makes me laugh. Guy on out LDV page got told by Adrian Flux that he CANT use it as a motorhome as it was still insured as a bus and cant change that until the reg doc was changed. Having said that Adrian Flux dont know there arse from there elbow but where do you stand? If i was insured as a bus/van or even in conversion and done but refused what would plod say to me and the wife sleeping in the van as a camper. Could the ferry company penalise you if you book as a camper. If i can use it as a camper can i do 60mph on country roads. Aaaaallllsoooooo. Van gets stolen. You will only get paid out for a van not the camper contents. Cant see insurance company insuring you as a camper if DVLA say its a van.

kenbw2 · 2019-09-05 11:49:35

Actually I'm insured with Adrian Flux (I'm pretty happy with them tbh) and the van is insured as a "Camper in conversion". Getting it DVLA reregistered means cheaper premiums though.

Casper · 2019-09-05 13:51:39

kenbw2 wrote:

Actually I'm insured with Adrian Flux (I'm pretty happy with them tbh) and the van is insured as a "Camper in conversion". Getting it DVLA reregistered means cheaper premiums though.

They have a rep on the SBMCC forum. He just jumps in when folk start asking about insurance and recommends his company but when you start to ask questions he will not give you a quote even though at the time the site said he will. Web site could not give me an online quote and when i asked him why he said it does and started to get rude about it as it certainly did not. That is when i started looking into reviews and not the crap on there own site

Here are a few

https://www.reviews.co.uk/company-revie … rian-flux1

OK we like a cheap deal but to many people found issues with them when time came to making a claim so i started to shop around after that

Got both my vans insured through AIB Insurance and next year they will be insuring my bike also. I pay an extra £70 for breakdown cover what gives 90 euro days and no hight, weight or age restriction what is great having a heavy old bus big_smile

Anyway. Mind and do recorded delivery with your letter to DVLA

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#1 2019-08-30 17:00:56

DVLA says my van doesn't look like a camper from the outside

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#18 2019-09-02 08:58:46

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#19 2019-09-02 11:29:58

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#20 2019-09-02 23:31:02

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#21 2019-09-03 22:59:20

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#22 2019-09-04 00:42:19

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